Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the printed transcript of a September 9, 2025 hearing held by the U.S. House Oversight Committee's Task Force on the Declassification of Federal Secrets, chaired by Rep. Anna Paulina Luna. The witnesses were Jeffrey Nuccetelli, Alexandro Wiggins, George Knapp, Dylan Borland and Joe Spielberger. They described UAP incursions at Vandenberg Air Force Base from 2003 to 2005 and a tic-tac-shaped object seen from USS Jackson in 2023. Members criticized AARO and called for whistleblower protections and the UAP Disclosure Act.
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39 I cannot imagine that any whistleblower or witness will ever go to AARO again because of what happened under the first director, who is now long gone but still seems to act as the spokesperson for that organization. Mr. BIGGS. And I would say, Madam Chair, maybe at some point we need to really dig deep into AARO, and I would encourage us—— Mrs. LUNA. Oh, I would be happy to send maybe a subpoena to Mr. Kirkpatrick. Mr. BIGGS. Mr. Nuccetelli, you have testified that official Air Force records of the red square incident are now held by AARO and the FBI. Has Congress or you been denied access to those records? And on what grounds would we be denied access, you or us? Mr. NUCCETELLI. No, the records are unclassified, so—— Mr. BIGGS. Okay. Mr. NUCCETELLI [continuing]. They can provide them to you. Mr. BIGGS. In the 2003 to 2005 incidents you described, were any physical effects, electromagnetic interference, radio anomalies, or security system disruptions documented in base logs or any re- ports, official reports? Mr. NUCCETELLI. Not to my knowledge, no. Mr. BIGGS. Mr. Wiggins, has the full resolution unedited footage of your incident been provided to Congress? Chief WIGGINS. Yes. Mr. BIGGS. Okay. Were you or your crew ever instructed formally or informally not to document or discuss the event ever? Chief WIGGINS. No. Mr. BIGGS. Good. Mr. Borland, you have talked about manipula- tion of your security clearance records. Can you identify which agencies or offices were responsible and whether they provided any written justification? Mr. BORLAND. I can do that in a SCIF, sir, 100 percent. Because of being a part of a multi-agency special access program, I cannot give those publicly. Mr. BIGGS. So, I would encourage us, Madam Chair, to have that SCIF meeting if we can. And then, Mr. Borland, again for you, you testified that you withheld certain sources and methods from AARO due to mistrust. Can you give us some specifics that led you to believe they were misrepresenting the truth? Mr. BORLAND. Well, as I said already, what I said about scientific methods, scientific control, extraterrestrials, I mean, I know what I have seen, I know what I know, and I know it is true, so any agency that is going to go public and try and manipulate the public perception of this subject in such a way that is negative when I know the truth about it is why I had extreme reservations with it. And also what I have been through and other whistleblowers and people in the know about this subject have been through. Mr. BIGGS. So, Madam Chair, thank you for letting me waive on. I think the key thing there you talked about was manipulation of message, manipulation of narrative. That is really the problem with this entire system that we have seen since you have started these wonderful hearings, Madam Chair, and I thank you so much. Mrs. LUNA. Thank you, Representative Biggs.
Hearing transcript, from the govinfo collection. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is above. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.