Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the printed transcript of a September 9, 2025 hearing held by the U.S. House Oversight Committee's Task Force on the Declassification of Federal Secrets, chaired by Rep. Anna Paulina Luna. The witnesses were Jeffrey Nuccetelli, Alexandro Wiggins, George Knapp, Dylan Borland and Joe Spielberger. They described UAP incursions at Vandenberg Air Force Base from 2003 to 2005 and a tic-tac-shaped object seen from USS Jackson in 2023. Members criticized AARO and called for whistleblower protections and the UAP Disclosure Act.
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35 The other bill, the UAP Disclosure Act, which was filed last year, Senator Schumer, who I cannot believe that there is a topic that he and I agree on, but he and I agree on this topic. He has spon- sored it in the Senate. He put it on the National Defense Author- ization Act last year. Remarkably, I cannot get it on the—it was stripped out by the House last year, and I cannot get it onto the bill leaving the House this year. Mr. Knapp, how far would that bill go to actually getting the an- swers that we need? Mr. KNAPP. Pretty far. I think that you are still going to have roadblocks. You know, the keepers of secrets, the private compa- nies that have been doing this job for intelligence agencies for a long time are not going to cough it up. You would have to force it out of them. And whether you can get them to admit that they have it or not, I mean, they are supposed to lie about it. They have been lying about it. You know, I—more power to you. I hope it works. I hope it passes this time, but it is a daunting challenge to get them to open up after lying about it for more than 75 years. Mr. BURLISON. Yes. And then finally, Mr. Borland, when you en- gaged with AARO in 2023, you noted that their public statements did not match the reality that you and others had witnessed. In your assessment, what were the key limitations of AARO? Mr. BORLAND. You know, I would put it to you this way. The statement AARO has made is scientific evidence of extraterrestrials. Scientific evidence requires a scientific control. Extraterrestrial is an entity on another planet. The only way to sci- entifically prove extraterrestrial is we have to go to that planet, ac- quire technology, bring it back, and compare it to what we have here. Mr. BURLISON. So, you are saying they will not let anything out because—or they will not come forward unless they confirm that it—unless they go to the planet and confirm where its origin is? Mr. BORLAND. That would be scientific evidence, yes. And by that statement, AARO found no scientific evidence of extraterrestrials is basically—I do not want to call it a psyop, but a misrepresentation because we do have things. But making that statement is not tech- nically a lie. It is a misrepresentation of the full truth. Mr. BURLISON. Thank you. Ms. BOEBERT. Madam Chair, may I, just since we are on that topic real quick, how do we get to these other planets? How do we pass the Van Allen radiation belt safely? Mr. BORLAND. Good question for you. I cannot answer that for you. Ms. BOEBERT. Thank you. Mrs. LUNA. I would now like to recognize Mr. Perry for 5 min- utes. Mr. PERRY. Thanks, Madam Chair. I think I will start with maybe Mr. Borland. So, you have a clear- ance, right? You are in uniform. You have a clearance. When did you leave service? What year? Mr. BORLAND. I left in 2013, February 2013. Mr. PERRY. 2013. Who was the President, if you recall? Mr. BORLAND. 2013 would have been President Obama, sir.
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Hearing transcript, from the govinfo collection. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is above. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.