Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the printed transcript of a September 9, 2025 hearing held by the U.S. House Oversight Committee's Task Force on the Declassification of Federal Secrets, chaired by Rep. Anna Paulina Luna. The witnesses were Jeffrey Nuccetelli, Alexandro Wiggins, George Knapp, Dylan Borland and Joe Spielberger. They described UAP incursions at Vandenberg Air Force Base from 2003 to 2005 and a tic-tac-shaped object seen from USS Jackson in 2023. Members criticized AARO and called for whistleblower protections and the UAP Disclosure Act.
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27 destroying all their police records every three years on a schedule so—— Ms. BOEBERT. You were informed that this—that these docu- ments were destroyed? Mr. NUCCETELLI. Well, I have a Freedom of Information Act from the Air Force that states clearly that they destroy all police records on a 3-year schedule. Ms. BOEBERT. Okay. So, they were sitting on documentation, de- stroyed it, refused to question any of the lead investigators, any- thing leading into this investigation? Mr. NUCCETELLI. Yes, basically, they destroyed all the police records, so you could not even, like, call the Air Force and ask them if there was a vehicle accident in that timeframe. So that is a big problem. We are losing data in real time, so we will never be able to go back and track—— Ms. BOEBERT. I think our Federal Government has a history of destroying records. Thank you. Thank you very much, Mr. Nuccetelli. Dr. Borland, as a geospatial intelligence officer, have you seen classified data indicating UAPs operate in restricted U.S. airspace? And has that information been withheld from Congress? Mr. BORLAND. I have not in U.S. airspace. That is intelligence oversight, so I did not have domestic authorities. Ms. BOEBERT. After filing your inspector general complaint over retaliation inside the Pentagon’s UAP office, did you receive any kind of protection or just more retaliation? Mr. BORLAND. Within the IG or the—or AARO, ma’am? Ms. BOEBERT. Either. Mr. BORLAND. AARO, they went after the staff member and clas- sified everything, shut that down. The IG, to this day, I do not even know if my complaint’s active. I know my attorney that rep- resented me was very, very, very concerned. And the best of my un- derstanding, I was determined credible, not urgent. Ms. BOEBERT. And do you think that that experience would sug- gest that the internal UAP investigations may be compromised? Mr. BORLAND. Possibly. I mean, it is so hard because this goes back to people doing the job they are told to do. And very few peo- ple are going to want to give up their careers, 20-, 30-year pension, give up—get rid of their kids’ healthcare, get rid of their house. It is possible, yes. Ms. BOEBERT. Yes. Thank you very much, Dr. Borland. Mr. Spielberger, do national security whistleblowers currently have any external appeals processes to challenge retaliation, or are they just stuck relying on the same agencies that they are accus- ing? Mr. SPIELBERGER. Congresswoman, this is one of the biggest con- cerns that we at POGO have, basically, around the independence of investigations and accountability for retaliation. Basically, yes, national security whistleblowers have to rely on internal adminis- trative processes that go through agency inspector generals. There are some differentiations, but the bottom line is that they are forced to rely on protection from the same agencies and people who they are alleging retaliated against them.
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Hearing transcript, from the govinfo collection. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is above. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.