Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the printed transcript of a September 9, 2025 hearing held by the U.S. House Oversight Committee's Task Force on the Declassification of Federal Secrets, chaired by Rep. Anna Paulina Luna. The witnesses were Jeffrey Nuccetelli, Alexandro Wiggins, George Knapp, Dylan Borland and Joe Spielberger. They described UAP incursions at Vandenberg Air Force Base from 2003 to 2005 and a tic-tac-shaped object seen from USS Jackson in 2023. Members criticized AARO and called for whistleblower protections and the UAP Disclosure Act.
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17 Mr. BORLAND. It is a difficult question to answer. I think prior to David Grusch and people beginning this process of bringing peo- ple into awareness of the reality of these programs and certain things people have witnessed, probably extremely widespread. I think today there is still an issue, but because people are able to come before you and people are speaking out, I think it has been somewhat less. I would hope, though, that people would because if this goes back into closed doors, this is going to get really ugly. Mrs. LUNA. What type of behavior have you witnessed from former AARO director Sean Kirkpatrick, as well as his staff, in re- lation to this information you provided to them? Did they ever try to classify this information as non-human technology? Mr. BORLAND. Good question. The problem with this is that I know what I experienced firsthand, and I know other things. I think the staff at AARO that I met with in March 2023, I think they were good people doing the job they were told to do. I did not meet with Kirkpatrick. He was either not present or did not want to meet me that day. However, they did classify informa- tion about the reality of this subject, and it was very concerning because in my AARO MFR, they had actually referenced a former staff member that was the one who told me to go there, and they probably should not have done that. Mrs. LUNA. And real quick before my time is up—and we might go to a second round of questioning just so you are all aware. How important, given everything that you have seen and experienced, is the UAP Disclosure Act of 2025 in restoring both public account- ability and trust? Mr. BORLAND. I think very important. I would hope, though, that the 7-year window could be shrunk, my opinion, but very impor- tant. The truth needs to be known. Mrs. LUNA. Thank you very much. I now recognize Jared Moskowitz of Florida. Mr. MOSKOWITZ. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. Thank you for allowing me to waive on to the Committee. I remember, you know, the last Committee when we had a bunch of former military personnel folks that either served on bases, were pilots, or were in different programs experiencing knowledge. It made me recognize that the narrative has changed, right? It is po- litically convenient for the government if you all were not military folks in suits. It would be much better if you pulled up in Winne- bagos and were wearing hats. And so, the picture of this, because that is important for the American people on how you tell a story, what the message looks like, and who the messenger is. So, this is now the second or third Committee where we have former military folks with impeccable records with information and knowledge. And it is definitely clear on a bipartisan basis that we have to protect our whistleblowers—there is no doubt—and in a day in which it is really hard to tell what is true or not from a po- litical standpoint. And so, I don’t really know what is true. I don’t know on this subject. But I do know when we are being lied to, and we are definitely being lied to. There is just no doubt about that. Mr. Wiggins, I want to talk to you. I find your background testi- mony compelling. When you first saw what you were looking at, what were your first thoughts?
Hearing transcript, from the govinfo collection. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is above. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.