“Nevers”49 pages
- p. 17 …of alien beings and elusive vehicles which never quite
seem to manifest themselves. Regardless of one…
- p. 31 …Conversely, there
has never been any previous documentary evidence produced by those who
would debunk the…
- p. 32 …This had never been
officially done before, although most of the persons contacted reported that they…
- p. 40 …Lt Col Cavitt also
stated that he had never taken any oath or signed any agreement…
- p. 77 …Because this conclusion is based on
the absence of documentation, the issue can never be definitively…
- p. 99 …H written, there is
good evidence through accessioning and microfilming records that the Agency never
received…
- p. 101 …histories and
supporting documents, and it has never routinely received the kind of records which
might…
- p. 159 …I have never been sworn to any form of secrecy by anyone concerning this matter and…
- p. 165 …It never crossed my mind that it could be anything but a radio sonde.
RW: How…
- p. 168 …as far as I knew, I never heard anyone say, "Don't talk about this
and…
- p. 169 …I never met LaPaz personally, but I knew what he was.
RW: Did Rickett go with…
- p. 170 …I forget since I was there in the Washington
area for awhile but I never did…
- p. 172 …To the best of my recollection, I never met the rancher, Brazel.
RW: O.K., because…
- p. 173 …rve never seen a Geiger counter myseU: but I didn't know if you knew what…
- p. 174 …ordered Marcel to accompany the rancher back
to Corona, •· You said you never saw... and then…
- p. 175 …I never had any idea that it was anything with the V-2. They told us…
- p. 177 …You and I never saw this. You don't see
any military people or military vehicles…
- p. 178 …said in a facetious way: "Lets make out like it never existed, because we're wasting…
- p. 179 …to him the crash and recovery had never happened.
There was no investigation on the Foster…
- p. 182 …No, I never saw this.
SC: I don't know what that is from.
RW: "But…
- p. 183 …So, some of there
records were TS and still are.) That is because they have never…
- p. 185 …Cav never
told me anything. He said nl never tell you anything then you won't…
- p. 189 …I am quite sure that we never gave it a thought until that book.
- p. 190 …Now, we have never found the ftight records to
substantiate that, so I don't know…
- p. 202 …related
to this inquicy and I have never been threatened by US Government persons concerning not…
- p. 207 …related to this inquiry
and I have never been threatened by US Government persons concerning refraining…
- p. 213 …We never considered a ..planneq cover story; we were concerned with security.
I was the project…
- p. 214 …I never obsCJVed any of the balloon "trains" but I
did see some of the early…
- p. 225 …and subsequent models were
brand new, had never flown anything like that in this area.
A…
- p. 228 …I'd never heard the
name Mogul -- the classification was that high. I knew what we…
- p. 240 …I just wanted to see
if there had been anything stated to you never to discuss…
- p. 242 …but I never knew Marcel.
in my mind, and there are
Yeah, I knew that guy…
- p. 243 …I've never seen a Japanese balloon that I know
of, I've never seen the…
- p. 246 …No, I've never seen this.
Trakowski argued that even the name Mogul was classified,
and…
- p. 249 …Out PM with
several NYU men by weapons carrier, but we never located it.
Rocket postponed…
- p. 264 …As far as I know we just
never interfaced with the military.
Q: Where were you…
- p. 266 …We never saw
anybody in security. There was certainly nobody keeping us
secure. If anything, we…
- p. 273 …who was writing a story,
and I never quite could determine whether he was on the…
- p. 274 …I have never seen such a document nor have I ever heard of
any effort to…
- p. 277 …radar
reflectors for tracking purposes-but it never comes out talking about MOGUL and the instrumentation…
- p. 278 …I never met Richard Robert Crane. I knew him only by the path of debris he…
- p. 282 …They never said it, but I know they did because they left me free to
do…
- p. 318 …Before now, however, a larger portion of the story was never
told. Recent research indicates that…
- p. 320 …and Project MOGUL as first conceived was never put into operational 1use.
However, MOGUL did serve…
- p. 321 …Moore, NYU Constant-Level
Balloon Project Engineer, stated that they were never informed of the classified…
- p. 567 …and this flight 11as never recovered. Pre-
sumably the marked easterly flow then observed above 60…
- p. 591 …ficienoy since on-ot.f' operation was never per-
mitted.
The temperature data of' these flights…
- p. 740 …The theodolite lost the balloon in clouds earlier and
the airplane observer never succeeded in seeing…
- p. 815 …Out pm with several NYU by weapon carrier but we never located it. Rocket
postponed until…
PROFESSOR MOORE - 6/8/94
Q: we have tried to reach Colonel Trakowski, and he has
not returned our calls. We'~e left messages on his answering
machine, and there's been no response.
A: He may be out of town. I did visit him last October,
and he made the point that ..• He was our project officer. He
and I served together under Colonel Duffy in the Air Force
Liaison Office in 1943 to ..• Well, I went overseas in 1 44 but
Trakowski stayed and took a commission in the Air Force when it
was offered and was the project officer on Mogul. I have some
paperwork here from General LeMay's files in which after the war
a number of people were to be sent overseas because they had not
had overseas duty. There is a history of Colonel Trakowski.
Perhaps you have it from the Pentagon files already, from the AG
files.
Q: We have some records, yes.
4
A: Anyway, Albert Trakowski was the Watson Laboratory
project officer on this. When I raised this question to him he
said he had talked to John Peterson, one of Colonel Duffy's
procurement men, and they were joking about these markings on the
tape. I have a letter that I can give you a copy of in which I
quote Trakowski in saying, "What do you expect when you have your
targets made by a toy factory in Manhattan?"
Q: So essentially, the original targets were made by a toy
company?
A: Well, it's either a toy company or a garment
manufacturer in the garment district in Manhattan, or it was by a
novelty company. I talked to Ed Istvan who was another one of
the Air Force liaison office people who stayed in. Istvan lives
in your area. I can give you documentation on these things.
Istvan says that it was some outfit that extruded toothpaste
tubes and he got involved with them because they made radar
chaff. In the early days of this effort, there were a number of
different targets made. I don't have them here, I have them
· downstairs, there were a number of different forms the targets
were made. One idea was just the inside of a meteorological
balloon, to put radar chaff and adhere it with glycerine. Just
wet the inside of the balloon with glycerine and then shake in
dipoles cut to the proper half wave length. When the balloons
were inflated, these would be all on the inside, coating the
inside of the balloon. This didn't give nearly the sort of
target that the corner reflector gave.
But anyway, Istvan initially went to New York hunting for a
source of supply and came across a company.
(Pause)