Richard Helms Interviewed by R. Jack Smith, 21 April 1982

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the talking. And Laird was trying to persuade him that the Soviets were going for a first strike. And
were going to go for a build-up much larger than Fulbright believed.
(U/F&) JS: Which underlined the requirement for the ABM [Anti Ballistic Missile].
(U/-) RH:That’s right! But in any event, the fact remains that now when you look back
historically Laird was closer to being right than Fulbright was. Even though most sentiment at the time
was on Fulbright’s side. So it’s another way of saying that the estimating business is a damn lonely
business. [Laughter]
JS: Well, it’s one of those anomalies of history that too often - it seems to me - the bastards have
tmed out to be right. After WWII, when we were all trying to follow the beat of getting along with the
Russians, we could live with them, they could be copartners in some kind of a world settlement - uneasy
perhaps, but still, we could work out something. And all the extreme rightists were saying never-never-
never, and of course, they turned out to be right. Perhaps for the wrong reasonsj.but right. And I think
feelings he had to get the ABM built.
it’s true of Laird. Laird’s basis for thinking that, I think, was almost entirely emotional and based on his * I .
(UFWO)RH:And Laird, interestingly enough you know, compared with some of the people that are
now in office, was not regarded as hard-lined at all. In fact, if he walked in here, he’d say, “Me, hard
lined! I’m just a patsy.” So it’s a bit of extraordinarily interesting debate. If we had these days enough
responsible people with the wit to look at that debate and examine the nuclear debate which is now just
cascading all over us. There are some very good lessons to be learned. You mustn’t let your emotions
control what has got to be done. I’m just amazed at some of the proposals that are coming out by people
who seem to think that all of a sudden they’ve discovered Armageddon and they’ve got to prevent it.
And it’s their sole responsibility.
(UkX&O) JS: But nothing has changed all of a sudden. The problem’s been there all along. I had this
discussion at dinner last night. Nothing’s changed; it’s just the way it’s been.
( U / F k O ) RH: Jack Smith, back in the fifties, you remember as well as I do, there were students on
college campuses saying that they weren’t going to do any work cuz’ after all they were going to be
obliterated by a nuclear bomb. There were other people who were agitating and going out into
communes because they figured that they better live in the country because the cities were gonna be
nuked. Then, all of a sudden, that just disappeared. Under the pressures of Vietnam or whatever it was.
And then for 20 years you don’t hear anything about it, and then all of a sudden, bang! It comes right
back and it’s the same.
(U) JS: A certain amount of boredom and apathy sets in too ya’ know. After a while you get tired of
being so scared, you start thinking about something else.
(U) RH: Who was it, Henry James, that said people liked wars, particularly non-participants, because it
gives them the thrill of excitement to an otherwise dull and tedious life.
(U) JS: Look at the Falkland Islands. The most exciting thing, it’s better than any TV show, better than
Brideshead revisited.
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